How To Use Personality Profiles To Hire Rockstars And Build Teams Inside Of Your Company!
"I wish I would've known these things years ago. Like right now, you helped coach the Inner Circle for years, which half the time, they're coming in for marketing help. And they spend more of the time like, "Oh, that's what I'm doing. My company's failing, because I don't have anyone who's a High-C who could actually help me." All those pieces that they're missing. I think that the biggest thing with that, again, moving forward, I would make sure every entrepreneur I worked with, had a chance to go through this. We could see their stuff ahead of time, as well as their teams, because then you can see really quickly like, "Oh, there's the gap in your team.""
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Russell Brunson: Hey, good morning, everybody, this is Russell Brunson. Welcome back to the Marketing Secrets Podcast. Today, I'm going to share with you something that I'm really excited about and something that's not completely finished yet. This is a project we've been working on for probably a year or two now. We had a couple hiccups come up along the way, but it's a company I'm creating and launching called understand.me.
It's all about understanding yourself better, understanding your teammates better, understanding your employees, understanding your coaching clients, understanding everybody better. It all has to do with personality profiling and a bunch of other stuff. And so, without spoiling the surprise of what's going to be happening in the company, we did last year do a summit where we interviewed a whole bunch of experts on different personality profiles and different tests, like the Enneagram, and 5 Love Languages, and DiSC, and Myers-Briggs, and a whole bunch of other ones.
And after we did the entire summit, Mandy and Mike, who were the hosts of the summit, who are some of my close friends, awesome people, they asked if I would be on the summit as well. But more specifically, instead of me showing here's how one test works, it was more like explain how you're using testing in your life, in your business to hire people, build teams, and all that kind of stuff. And so, this interview is really fun because it goes into different tests, different things.
I think you guys will really enjoy it. If you've done personality profiling in the past, you're probably like me and you love them, and you're obsessed with them. So, this will give you more fuel for the fire. And if you've never done them before, I'm hoping this will spark something and get you excited because there are just so many cool things you can learn, and you can do when you understand these tools. So, with that said, we're going to cue the theme song. When we come back, you have a chance to hear Mike and Mandy interviewing me about how we use personality tests to hire people, and build our teams, and do a bunch of other cool stuff. So, that said, thanks you guys, and hope you enjoy this episode.
Mandy Keene: Hi everyone, Mike and Mandy here. We're so excited to be interviewing Russell Brunson. This is a big deal. This is a special interview. So, we're going to be interviewing Russell on his vision for understand.me. We wouldn't be here, this summit wouldn't exist without this man. So this is a special interview, and for those of you who don't know Russell, he's got an amazing background. So, I'm going to share with you a little bit about this man. He first started his online company while he was wrestling in college. Within a year of graduation, he had sold over a million dollars of his own product and services from his basement. I mean, that's what we did when we were in college, same thing, same story. We could all relate. Over the past 19 years, this is a big deal, this makes me excited. This New York Times Bestselling Author, New York Times.
If you guys know, that is not easy to accomplish. He has built over a following of over a million entrepreneurs, sold hundreds of thousands of copies of his books, popularized the concept of sales funnels. So, if you heard that term sales funnels, it's because of this man right here. He co-founded the software company called ClickFunnels, which has helped over 100,000 entrepreneurs to quickly get their message out to the marketing place. And on a personal note, Mike and I feel so fortunate to know you. We've known Russell for over 10 years. I would like to say, what's even more impressive than all these amazing accomplishments is this man has such a good heart and he really cares about people. And so, that's why we said yes when he invited us to be a part of this. And so, we're super excited to have you here. Thank you for making the time to share with everyone about what you've learned with assessments and what inspired you to create understand.me.
Russell: No worries. I'm excited to be here and excited to talk about this. The first time I actually publicly talked about this stuff at all, so I'm excited too, it'll be so fun.
Mike Ryan: So, you're really the visionary behind understand.me. Just the idea, the concept of combining all the assessments into one. How did you come up with that? And what inspired you to do that?
Russell: Yeah, so the real story, actually, the first person ever introduced me to any kind of assessment was Mandy.
Russell: She was like, "Hey, something's wrong with you, you should take this test."
Mandy: I did not say that.
Russell: And so she got me the DiSC test initially and it was really cool. I took it, sent Mandy the results, and then came back and started telling me about myself and I was like, "Oh weird." And it helped me to understand myself. A lot of things, I thought, potentially were things that I was dumb, or I was slow, or something. It made me not feel dumb. I was like, "Oh, this is what I am. This is what I'm not." And it made me feel more comfortable with who I was. Initially, it was just me and then we had Mandy come in and start helping people in our company and they started taking it. And also I started understanding my relationships with other people better and that became the next fascinating thing.
And then a little while later is when James P. Friel was like, "You need to take 16Personalities, Myer-Briggs Test." And I was like, "I already got DiSC, I'm good." He's like, "No, take this one too." So I took that one, it opened me up to this whole new world of all these things, introverts, extroverts, people open loops, closed loops, and thinkers, feelers, all these things I didn't know about. And then I was like, "This is really cool, what else is there?" And then I found out about Love Languages, and Enneagram, and all these ones. I started taking them and it was fun because I learned something different about myself and each one, but I would meet people and be like, "Okay," trying to feel like, "what are you?"
But then there's so many things I never really knew. I had a lot of friends and I'm like, "Okay, take these three tests real quick." And I take them and I was like, "Okay, now I understand how to interact with you." Or things like that. And I remember one day not too long ago I was thinking, wouldn't it be cool if there was a place you could go and take all the tests and then be given a page where it's just like, you know. And this is the long-term future of the company. You guys will see, there'll be pages and credits like, "Russell Brunson understand.me," and it'll show me and all my profiles. So in a glimpse, I can see what I am, or what you are, other people are. And I think for me, it's been such a useful tool to help me understand how to interact with people. It's such a good tool for myself, to understand myself, my kids, other things. And so that's kind of why we decided to put this together. And since you were the person who taught me about it initially, obviously brought you in, and love to have Mike as well.
Mandy: Well, we are honored and we love it because we are assessment geeks as well and it has helped our lives so much. And so we thank you for having this vision. If you don't mind sharing with everyone, and this is a little bit more personal as far as like, what was your DiSC results? And what either surprised you or you found really helpful like, "Oh no wonder I struggle with people who are maybe even different," or, "No wonder I'm that way." What did you learn about yourself when you took the DiSC?
Russell: Yeah, so many cool things. One of them was, for those who want to know, I am a High-D, High-I, High-S, no C at all. It's funny my mom used to tell me as a kid, "You are the dirtiest kid I've ever seen in my life. You can never clean up your room." And I just, I don't even see it, I don't even notice it, right? And in school, I can never get through school and all the papers and the homework. I couldn't do it and I always thought I was dumb growing up. And even in business, I was really bad at organizing things and it was always frustrating me. I think finding out that I was low C, that's okay.
We'll talk about this later, since then I found if I surround myself, people that are High-Cs, I can work with them and it works really well. But when I took that off me like, "You're not dumb. You're just not going to be somebody who's going to be super organized." So I quit trying to become the best organizer in the world because it's just not going to make sense to you. That was a big thing. Also, for me, I have a High-D and a High-S which, they counteract each other. And, we were talking about this before we started recording, I have tons of internal turmoil about this. Because I'm like the D who wants to drive, get things done, and then I'm the S who's super faithful, and nice, and doesn't want to hurt anyone's feelings. And so I have this weird thing in business situations where I'm like, "I want to yell at somebody, but I can't cause I'm too nice."
And it's just frustrating. I have this internal turmoil, but at least I understand it now. And I'm like, "Okay, in this situation, I got to be a driver," or in a situation, I need to have more empathy, or whatever. I can start switching now that I'm aware, as opposed to just sitting here, tied up in a knot, like I don't know what to do. And so those are some of the things that helped. Also on the values, what I thought was super powerful for me, one of the biggest a-has for me, was my biggest value is the economics, which you told me, it meant ROI. I like to have a return on investment. And I realized that in myself, the things that I've succeeded with in life, are things that I can see the ROI. When I was a wrestler, I lifted weights, I ran, I did all these things, I could see the ROI. If I can't see the ROI, it was really hard.
So as I've wanted to do new things in my life where, I knew there was something I want to do, but it's hard to see the ROI. For example, in my religion, I wanted to read more scriptures. But it's hard, every morning you wake up and you read, you're like, "I don't see a tangible ROI every single day." It was hard. So for me, I was like, "I need to figure out a way to tie an ROI to this so that it'll make me want to keep doing it." So I was like, okay, well, if I launch a podcast on what I'm learning, then I'm going to learn it. I'm going to record a podcast, which goes to this, then I'll see people listening to it, and then that was an ROI. And all of a sudden, now there's a reason for me to do this because I got a published episode that's going to help people. And it switched in my head, now I can start pursuing that thing. And so I try to trick myself now like, what's the ROI, and making sure there's tangible ROIs on things to motivate myself to do things I'm not typically motivated by. So that's a couple of the cool things I learned from my DiSC.
Mandy: Oh, I love how you implemented it.
Mike: That's such a great example of how you've implemented it personally. I know that before understand.me, you used DiSC primarily for a while. Could you talk about applying DiSC in your or company, ClickFunnels, and what's been the biggest benefit there?
Russell: Yeah, what's actually interesting is most of our hires nowadays happen from personality profiling. And this is because of Mandy, because I almost made a really bad mistake. So I was looking for a new position and it was in a position that's like the yin-yang of me. Somebody who can just be super organized, things like that. So I sent out a bunch of applications, we got hundreds of people applying, I'm going through it all. I flagged my top 10 like, "oh these are the people." And I had people submit video applications, so I saw them pitching me on why they'd be the best person for this role. I was so excited, I had broken down my top 10. I was like, "I can't figure it out, these people all seem so amazing." So I was like, let me send it to Mandy and give me your feedback. And first thing she said, "well get their DiSC profiles."
We got DiSC profiles and sent it to Mandy. She looked at all of them, she's like, "oh, you going to hate all these people" I'm like, "What do you mean? I hung out, I talked to them, I would hang out with these guys every single day and it'd be so much fun." She's like, "That's the problem. You're going to hire someone just like you. You're not looking for someone like you, you're looking for somebody to compliment you like the opposite. You need someone who's High-S, High-C because that's someone who's going to be faithful, they're going to be super organized, and they're going to take the mess you create and actually organize it." And I was like, "Oh." And I look back through all the people, none of them. All of them are High-D, High-I. So I loved them because they're like me and they had great selling, and that's why I liked them. And I was like, "Dang it."
So I went back to all our applications and we had everyone go back, retake the DiSC, and I said, "Okay, just send me the applications of people that are High-S, High-C." We got them all back and we looked at it. And based on not them pitching on why their best position, but based on the personality profile, we found a couple candidates. From there we hired someone and that person has been now with me three or four years, probably one of my favorite people we've ever hired ever. And it came off of me hiring the person who had the right personality match, not the person who sold me the best. And that was a big a-ha.
So now it's been interesting as we look for new positions, the question is not "what's the resume look like," whatever. It's like, "what's the personality that fits the job description we're looking for?" And we have people go take the personality profile, send it to us, and if they match that, then we go back, and have them send us a resume, and then we'll talk to them. But we make sure that we save ourselves so much time and effort and energy, finding someone who's most likely to be successful in the role that we're looking for them to be in any way.
Mandy: See, it makes such a big difference. And what I love about working with you is you're so coachable. You were like, "I know I bursted your bubble," and you're like, "I'm so excited!" And you're like, "Oh." But something that I admire, what you've done with ClickFunnels, is you being a low C. And what I've noticed coaching so many High-D business owners, they tend to do what you wanted to do, which is they hire a lot of people who are like them. And then that inevitably creates a chaotic environment because, like you said, it's messy, right? You don't have that High-C. But you didn't do that, like when we did the DiSC training and we broke down your executive team. Melanie, your right arm, Todd, co-founder of ClickFunnels, High-C, and most of your executive team has that C.
How has DiSC helped you with working with people who are different than you? And you knowing because you're such a low C, and then you got these High-Cs, what's that experience been like? And what advice would you give other low Cs who are watching this working with other High-Cs?
Russell: Yeah. It's interesting. I had someone, a mentor, his name's Alex Mandossian, way when I first got started only 15 years ago. It was when I was getting started and I was just running a million miles a minute, trying all these things. And I had a moment with him, he told me something that stuck with me, he said, "There's two types of people in this world. There's people who are starters and people who are finishers." He says, "You have to figure out which one you are, and surround yourself with the other people." And I didn't know how that synced to DiSC or anything at the time, I just understood that. So I usually get started with chaos and starting stuff and then I would be like, "You're juggling these balls." I'm like, "Ah!" And I see my first early companies would all explode, because it was me juggling all these things I couldn't handle, and boom, it would just explode.
When he told me that, I was like, "Okay, I got to find finishers." And I didn't know what that meant, but I just knew it was people who weren't exactly like me, right? People who, when the chaos happens, can take it and then calm it down, and put it in an order where it's there, and now it's good. I remember about the time I was starting my speaking career, I had a couple people that I had brought on who, again, they were who I thought were going to be finishers. And I would come on stage speaking and I'd be speaking about something, I'd sell something, or I'd promise things, and he'd be in the back of the room, just taking notes on everything Russell promised to make sure that we could deliver on it. Because I'm just saying stuff I don't remember.
Then we get done, he's like, "Okay, I'm going to go do all this stuff now, to get all this stuff put together the way you just promised people." And so that was the first practical application when I started seeing it. So yeah, like you said, kind of intuitively I started hiring a lot of people like that, not knowing anything about personality profiles. But when the very first time you did the training with our team, you had everybody take it. It was so fascinating to see that, for the most part, where I was high, High-D, High-I, High-S, almost everyone I had were high-S and Cs around me. People who were super faithful, super organized, and they were my finishers. I'm a good starter and I needed a lot of finishers to help finish the things.
It's funny because I was just consulting a company recently, who again, a whole bunch of High-D, High-I guys who were aggressive, making much money, had much stuff. And on the outside you're just like, "These guys are so successful." And then when you get into the private room with them and they're like, "Our lives are mess. I have no idea what I'm going to do." And I asked them the same question I'm like, "Have you taken DiSC?" They're like, "Yeah." I'm like, "What are you?" And they're like, "Oh, we're the drivers." I'm like, "Do you have any SCs around you?" They're like, "no." I'm like, "This is like the root of all your problems right now is you're creating chaos and there's nobody to finish it. You're starters, you're not finishers. And you need finishers or else you may make a bunch of money for a little while, but it's not going to last long term."
So it's been interesting watching people then come back, and same thing. Now they're like, "Okay, I need finishers. I need S and Cs. I need these people and try to find them. And we've also seen the other side of people come to our world. They want to be entrepreneurial and they're coming in and they're just lazily just doodling around. And their Google Sheets are all organized and their stuff's all perfect, but they can't make any money. We have a friend who's a naturopath who, same thing, great guy, very organized. But his business isn't growing because there's not a D in there who's just going to go and take this thing over. A lot of times I've come to people like that and say, "Look, you need to find a High-D, High-I who wants to go sell and do things.
Todd Dickerson who built ClickFunnels, smartest human I've ever met in my life. If it was just him, ClickFunnels, he'd be coding on it. It'd be getting better and better and better, but no one knowing about it. He had me as the High-D, High-I who's coming out here yelling about it, screaming, freaking out, excited. And then he's the S and C, creating the things that we're doing. And one without the other never would've worked and you had to have both things. So understanding that and being okay with like, "Okay. It's not me who's going to be an all-star. How do I build my Avenger team of people, the people I need around me to support me, so I can actually do the thing we need to do?"
Mandy: I love that. I love how you broke down the benefits and how you've used it in building such a successful company like ClickFunnels.
Mike: So what do you see as far as the future of understand.me? These are incredible examples of how you've used assessments in business and then people that you've mentored have used assessments in their business. What about just life in general? And how do you see people using understand.me to see all of their profiles in one place? How could they use that in different aspects of their life?
Russell: Yeah. I was joking with one of my friends I was like, "Can you imagine if you were," and I've been married now for 18 years, so I don't know how that all works, but you're on the app, swipe left, I swipe left or whatever. Or you ask them on a date, beforehand, ahead of time, be like, "Hey, can you fill this? Go fill this thing out and let me know about you ahead of time." They give you the profile, and you're like, "Our love languages don't match." You'd save yourself so much time and energy if you could see those things. Same with a job interview if you're hiring people. So my goal with understand.me is to give it so that, if I'm hiring someone, the first step is like, "Hey, before I look at any resumes, go fill out a profile and send us your link."
We can look at it in a brief thing like, "Look, you don't fit for this, but we are looking for someone in this role, which you fit really well here." Things like that. Or if I'm dating somebody, let me go look at your profile. Like, "Oh, there's a good shot we're going to be a good match." Or it's like, "I've dated High-Ds in the past and didn't work out." You know, whatever that thing might be. I just think it's going to help. First off, again, the first goal is help you understand yourself. And second off is just all of our interactions, and it could be times we have to work together, relationships, so many different things. I think it's just going to be a tool that's going to help people connect and understand each other better.
Right now, especially the time of the world we live right now, there's so much misunderstanding. Everyone is angry and fighting. And there's this thing I think, that my personal belief, I think the most, not everybody, but most everybody does things out of good to tensions. But they're just viewing the world through completely different lenses. And I think that we always think, "No, how do you not see this?" Like, "This is the world." It's like, "Yeah, but that's the world you see." Because these personality profiles, if you look at it from different lenses, the world looks completely different. So it gives you more empathy for other people and more understanding. Just understanding like, "Hey, they have good intentions. They're trying their best." I look at things differently and maybe I'm wrong, maybe they're right, maybe vice versa. But it gives you more ability to work well with people. And hopefully this will be a tool that helps bridge those gaps and makes it so that people can work better, have better relationships, and be happier.
Mandy: Well, we know that it's helped us and our friendship. And what's interesting is interviewing all these experts. I've known this man for 25 years, I thought I knew everything about him. But diving deeper into some of these assessments I'm like, "Oh, that's why you do that! That drives me nuts." Or, me too, you're like, "Oh, no wonder you do-"
Mike: That explains it.
Mandy: I find that any time I judge, it's because I don't understand, and that is what the awareness of the assessments do. If you don't mind sharing with everyone, because you mentioned Todd and he's so different than you, but he's like your partner in ClickFunnels and it's like marriage. A professional marriage, you guys have worked so closely together, late nights, early mornings, and you're so different. How has understanding how he's different? How has that helped you maybe resolve conflict or be able to get through some hard times? Because I find, in coaching people, people tend to like people who are like them, right? And we're comfortable with people who are like us, but you have gone down this road with Todd who's very different than you. What advice would you give people who are partnering or working with people who are so different than them?
Russell: Yeah. One thing is understanding each of the different things is like its own unique superpower, which is cool. And Todd and I's DiSC are very different, but if you look at our 16Personalities they're very similar, actually. The only difference is that I'm a feeler and he's a thinker. And at first, we had some clash, like, "No, this is how I feel!" And like, "No, this is what I think!" At first, we clashed on that, but then over time we got such a deep respect for both of each other, that I was like, "Man, if Todd's thinking something, he's really smart, so I trust his thinking.” And he's also been to me, like, "Hey, Russell's feeling this, I trust his intuition."
And so a lot of times when we have arguments, it's not even arguments, when we have a thing coming up, I'll send him a message, I use Voxer. So I'll Vox him, I'm like, "Hey Todd, so this is what I'm feeling," and I'll explain what I'm feeling. I said, "I want to know what you're thinking." And he'll message back like, "This is what I'm thinking." And he'll tell me what he's thinking. And then we look at it with that lens like, "Hey, this is what I'm feeling, this is what he's thinking. Do they sync? Are they opposite?" And we can kind of go back that. And what's nice is that after he tells me he thinks, I'll I have a feeling based on that again. So it's based on the new data that he's brought to the world that I would've never seen anyway, my feelings will shift sometimes like, "Oh my gosh, you're actually right. I miss this"
Or vice versa where he'll come in and tell me this. I'm like, "Yeah, but I feel this." And he's like, "Ah, I don't see it, but man, I trust your intuition. If you feel like that's the right thing, then let's try it." So it's been really cool because it's like a checks and the balances between us. Because I think if every decision I had, I felt this thing, I went for it every single time, we probably would've misfired. In fact, I think some of the misfires we had were definitely because I felt something that I ended up being wrong on. But it's just nice checks and balance, that's been super helpful. So I think it's understanding, that if you have a partner, and be understanding like, "My superpower's feeling, you're just thinking. Let's don't like use these as two battling things against each other, but respect each other and like use it." As like, "Hey, this is what I'm feeling, this is what you're thinking." You know, things like that. The other one that's been interesting to me, this one's not so much with me and Todd, but just me in meetings I struggled with. I can't remember what it is inside of 16Personalities, but it's talking about someone who opens loops or someone who closes loops.
Mandy: Oh, so you're the P, like you.
Russell: Yeah the P. That opens loops.
Mandy: And it’s the J.
Russell: So the P…
Mandy: Melanie and I, we like to close.
Russell: Yeah. So there's two kinds of people here. So loop openers like me, I have to open loops and visualize and talk about the future, all these things like this. It's like, "Ah!" And what's crazy is you're in a meeting with like 50 people that work for you, and you're talking these things, and they're all loop closers, they're like, "Okay, how are we going to do that? How many," they're freaking out like, "how are we going to close down that?" And then they come out of that meeting and they're freaking about every single thing you said. And you're like, "Stop. I get it." Like, "This is not closed yet. This is open." And like, I cannot tell you.
Mandy: It gives us anxiety!
Russell: Yeah, this is years of people hating me and I hating people. Because they're just like, "I don't want to share with you my ideas because you're, God, just rain on my parade," and all these things. And then they're freaking out like, "Don't tell me your ideas, we're trying to close these other loops you open." And as soon as we took 16Personalities and I learned that as a tool, it's like there's loop opens, loop closers. I was like, "Oh my gosh, I am driving these people crazy." Like, me opening loop is not me asking them to close the loop, it's me brainstorming, and visualizing, and dreaming. So we have meetings, I'd be like, "Hey guys, I'm going to open a loop real quick. Your job is not to close, it's just to sit here in the space and let me open it."
And they're like, "Oh, okay." So they're putting the iPad and paper down. So we're not doing anything, nothing is allowed to be done right now, I'm opening a loop and we're just going to go with it. So I sit them down, we open it and it's just like, I talk forever. And you see them itching. At the end of it, they'll ask me a question. I'm like, "I haven't already closed the loop yet." And they're like, "Okay." I'm like, "I'll tell you when I'm ready to close the loop." And then they have this permission to not stress out. I'm like, "Okay." And then they come to me a day later, two days later like, "Hey, we ready to close this loop yet?" I'm like, "No, not yet." "Okay." Come back. "Can we close the loop yet?"
I'm like, "Yeah, I'm ready to close it." I've thought through it in my head enough and I realized what's going to happen, I'll close the loop. Then they close it and then they're fine. But it's given us this tool that we can use when we're doing meetings and communicating where I'm not driving them crazy, they aren't driving me crazy, it's been such a powerful thing. These little tiny things that you start understanding, like my superpower's visualizing and daydreaming and all these kind of things, but it's like kryptonite for them, and visa versa. But if you use both tools together, man, it's so powerful. Soon as I'm ready to close the loop, I got a whole bunch of people like, "Okay, let's close these loops." And they're running, and they're putting things together, organizing, and all this stuff's happening that wouldn't happen otherwise, because I would just daydream forever. So it's kind of interesting.
Mandy: That's a great tip right there. You train your team to understand loops. You don't have to necessarily, because I think sometimes, especially people who are watching this, can get overwhelmed with learning all these assessments. But what I love that you did, is you didn't give an assessment presentation to your team. You just talked to them about how…
Russell: The one thing.
Mandy: Yeah, the one thing like, "I open loops, I know you close loops," and you train them on that. So now they understand you, so they're not going to hate you because they understand you. And then they're going to understand themselves like, "Okay, now I know why I'm itching to do it." That's so great. One of the things I found to be so invaluable in these assessments in coaching, is helping people understand what they need to recharge. Because we're not taught and we're so different.
And what you need to recharge can be very different than what I need to recharge. I find that sometimes there's guilt and shame tied to that, right? Because it's like, "Oh, I wish I was like this person," and we compare ourselves. And in coaching, I do my best to influence High-Ds in this very busy culture. And you're super busy, New York Times Best Seller, the multimillion dollar company. You have so much going on in your plate, and you're a very High-D. Can you share how making time to do physical vigorous activity, what that's done for you? And the benefits of you learning, like what we've gone over, and what you need to recharge so that you can be able to get all of this done?
Russell: Yeah. It's interesting too because I'm now seeing one of my sons, he's 10 years old, and he is very introverted and he has friends come over because he's a super cool kid, everyone loves him. So everyone wants to come play with Aiden, and they're coming over to play with him. And I see his friends leave and he's just like, "Dad, tomorrow, can you tell all my friends I can't play?" I'm like, "Why?" He's like, "I just want a day to myself. I just need to be." And so I see with him, which I never noticed in myself, because I the same way. I always feel guilty of like, "Why am I not normal?" Like everyone wants to go do things and all this kind of stuff. And it was really hard for me, especially as a marketer, I'm going to these networking events and stuff, and everyone's networking and talking and I'm just not feeling comfortable and then I'm like, "Oh, I want to die. Why am I like subjecting myself to this?"
And understanding for me, as an introvert, people don't believe me like, "You're not introverted because you're on stage talking or whatever." But that's not introvert-extrovert means, right? It's how you recharge. And so for me, it was understanding I need to go do this thing. I'm going to go down and network with people, but I'm going to leave early. I'm not going all night long and partying and playing like at 10 o'clock or 11, whatever, I'm going back to the room and I'm just going to go watch TV. I need to just watch TV or I'm going to hit the weight room in the morning. So I just need to get the nervous thing out of me so I can be present again the next day. Otherwise, I don't know if you're the same way, but if I don't do that, next morning I sit in bed and I'm just like, "I don't want to leave." It's still in there so much, that you can't go back out and do the things you need to do.
And I have noticed that at events before, I'm sitting in a hotel room and I just can't leave, I don't have the energy to go out. Or somebody's meeting at the office, I can't go into a group of people because I haven't recharged yet. If I'm not careful about that, and making sure that either the morning or somewhere I'm recharging, it's hard to come back sometimes to war and get in the midst of all the people and do what you need to do. So I think being aware of that, of what it is. But the other side, we've got other partners who are very extroverted. They go network, and then they go out singing karaoke until four in the morning, and then they're taking everyone back, and there's a coffee place or whatever. And they don't sleep all night, and it's just like-
Mandy: They're so happy.
Russell: Yeah. If I fall asleep, I'm not going to be recharged. I don't understand that but that's their path. And it's just like understanding that, and respecting each other, and doing the things you need for yourself.
Mike: You know what I love about these assessments and about understand.me is just that you become more conscious and aware of what you need, right? Or what other people need. And I love those stories about you talking with your business partners or other people in your life and just literally saying like, "Okay, I'm opening a loop." We do it to each other now like, "Okay, this is my Type Seven Enneagram coming out." Or Mandy will say, "I need to bring up my Type Eight and be more of a challenger." It's just interesting, life really changes, right? When you become more conscious and aware, and that's why I'm so excited about understand.me. Can you talk a little bit about your vision of how you see this really changing people's lives by becoming more aware and conscious of these things?
Russell: Yeah. I think it's true in all parts of our life. I think about as a kid, I was an athlete, so I could eat whatever I want because I'm working out a million times a day and it was fine. And then I got done and really quick after I stopped wrestling, I ended my career, I gained a ton of weight and I was like, "What? What's wrong? I'm doing what I was doing before." But now I gain like 50 or 60 pounds in a very short period of time and it's just doesn't make sense. It took me years to become aware of what I was actually doing. Realizing like, oh my gosh, you're eating 6,000 calories a day, I didn't know that.
Before I was burning 6,000 calories a day so I was fine, but when I stopped, you become aware of it. When you become aware of it, then you can change and you can tweak things. So many times in all of our lives were never of stuff, right? We plug in, we're doing the thing. And sometimes good things happen, sometimes bad things happen but we're not ever aware of it. Sometimes relationships work, sometimes they don't. Sometimes we're happy, sometimes we're sad, and we don't know why. And I think the more awareness that we have, the more we can affect things. When I understood weight and eating and calories and all these things, I was like, "Oh, well, that's why I feel this way. That's why I'm gaining weight." And I shift some things, I was aware of it and, it was really easy to drop the weight again. Like, "Oh, that was easy."
Like, "I'm not getting along with my spouse, or my business partner, my person." And it's like, "Ah, why is this not working?" And then you figure out, you become aware of it, and you make the shift and the change. Also, it's like, "Oh, this is actually really easy to do." It's just becoming aware of it and I think most people, unfortunately, live their lives without any awareness of most things. They're just drifting and wandering and kind of out there. So I think if this project and what we're doing can bring people more awareness. It's going to make people happier, it's going to make people feel more confident, more secure, more happy with themselves, more okay with themselves, and then make their relationships so much better at the same time. So that's my big vision, I think it's going to make everybody just understand, that's the goal. Understand yourself, understand other people.
Mike: Well, I think it's really going to change things because it's a place for, not only for you to understand yourself, but to share it with the whole world. That's the big difference. These tools have been around for a while, but there's been no place where you can store it. All those things to become aware of and conscious of, for yourself and others, to store it, and then share it with others and interact. I think it's going to change people's interactions, and daily lives, and the way they do things. So thank you so much for coming up with this idea and-
Russell: It'll be a thing, someone walks up to like, "Wait, before you introduce yourself, what's your understanding.me profile?" Like, "Oh cool. Yeah, we can be friends."
Mike: Yeah exactly.
Mandy: I know. Am I going to turn in one of those people where I'm like, "Yeah. So I'm going out to dinner with who? Okay. Can they take this first? Because this is just going to cut so much time." And then I can decide if I want to go to dinner or not. No, just kidding. But really I find that, we learned this from another friend ours, the more you know about someone, the more you tend to love them. And I find that what's happening right now in the world today, is we don't know about each other. And like you said, we don't understand the way that they're looking at the world.
One of the things I really admired about one of your superpowers, I don't think a lot of people know about unless they're really involved with the ClickFunnel community, is you're an incredible mentor for other entrepreneurs. And you have an incredible ability to see why they're stuck and to be able to help them grow their business. And that's why when they find out about you, and they find out about the superpower, everyone wants like, "Russell, help me. Show me how to help grow my business. Why am I stuck? What am I doing?" How do you see assessments specifically with helping entrepreneurs and business owners?
Russell: Oh yeah. I wish I would've known these things years ago. Like right now, you helped coach the inner circle for years, which half the time, they're coming in for marketing help. And they spend more of the time like, "Oh, that's what I'm doing. My company's failing, because I don't have anyone who's a High-C who could actually help me." All those pieces that they're missing. I think that the biggest thing with that, again, moving forward, I would make sure every entrepreneur I worked with, had a chance to go through this. We could see their stuff ahead of time, as well as their teams, because then you can see really quickly like, "Oh, there's the gap in your team."
The reason why is you have no driver, the reason why you're stuck at this level. Or you got a whole bunch of drivers, and the reason why you're stuck is because your fulfillment's horrible, because everyone's falling off the back. But it'd be really easy. Nowadays we hire based on personality, we don't hire based on a resume. You can do the same thing, I think if you could look at team dynamics, and you look at their team, and look in their profiles, you can see really quickly where the gaps are. Look at that. It'd be fun to do that as an experiment, just look at the teams, the team dynamics with just the things, and then come back and like, "My guess is, you were probably struggling here, here, and here, am I right?"
Russell: And you're like, "How did you know?" It's like-
Mandy: I'm psychic!
Russell: Because you're missing, yeah. It's like the Avengers, if they didn't have Hulk, they would've lost because Hulk's only do this piece of the puzzle, right? And if Hulk's out, they're going to struggle or Iron Man, and it's just like, you can't build the Avengers team if you're missing one of the superheroes. So this will help you identify where the things are so you can fit the gaps. But it'd be a really interesting thing to do. I think a lot of times we found that out intuitively, when we were coaching and walking through the process, and it took a while to get there, where we could get there really quickly and just be like, "Oh, there's your team. Yeah. That's why you're struggling."
Mandy: I love how you bring everything back to the Avengers team. You have a remarkable ability to do that. I love it.
Russell: It's important. Yeah.
Mike: Perfect. Well, thank you so much for doing this interview, for coming up with the idea. We so look forward to using it in our lives and helping other people use it in their lives and their businesses. And I think it's going to really be a game-changer, so thank you so much.
Russell: Yeah, no worries. Hope everybody loves this stuff. I know it's helped me and you guys so much in your life. Hopefully, it helps everybody else as well, to help understand themselves and the people that they love.
Mandy: That does. Thank you.
Mike: Thank you so much.